Pipe getting knocked out of closer spot was dumber than losing Trestles and adding Lemoore put together.
Earlier this morning, I was stalked by the historian Matt Warshaw, EOS/Above the Roar/HOS etc, who sought a rendezvous on the subject of the 2019 Pipe opener, and closer, being lost.
It’s the gloomy soothsayer, all heavy sighs, and the preposterously superficial BeachGrit principal, bubbly, at three paces!
We join the conversation.
BeachGrit: No Pipe opener nor closer for 2019. Does your heart weep?
Warshaw: I wasn’t even done being upset about Pipe getting knocked out of closer spot, which was a dumber move than losing Trestles and adding Lemoore put together.
Why so sad about losing the Pipe closer? It’s been years since it’s had a classic final day. A Super Bowl final in a six-foot bluewater swell in the Ments? Mightn’t that give you a little shiver?
Pipe I don’t think has ever been bad first heat to last. There’s always one or two great days, and hopefully you get a great final. That aside, it’s the anticipation of Pipe, the possibility of it. The whole season funnels down to that one break, that one event. You hold onto that when the wind goes shit at Peniche, or its Igarashi vs Flores at Bells. Pipe at the end of the tour is the great redeemer. And as far as the Mentawais . . . anybody high-intermediate or better can surf it. Nobody on tour is going to hair out at Rifles, or Macaronis. You want to see guys crack. You want to see Danny Wills and Mick Campbell crawl up inside themselves, as well as Slater and Sunny and John performing miracles. Jeremy Flores strikes me a bit of a douche, but fuck the guy steps up at Pipeline. The Ments will be a three-day promo video. I’ll watch it, the surfing will be amazing. But it isn’t the crucible. Pipe is the crucible.
I have no idea what logic, if any, is driving the WSL. Every now and then I’ll convince myself they’re five steps ahead of everybody, in terms of drop-kicking the sport into the mainstream. But mostly I think it’s a wish-and-prayer business model.
…Do you think the WSL thought it had the muscle to fuck with Honolulu and was surprised at their hard line?
The WSL is just slightly less mysterious than Skull and Bones. I have no idea what logic, if any, is driving them. Every now and then I’ll convince myself they’re five steps ahead of everybody, in terms of drop-kicking the sport into the mainstream. But mostly I think it’s a wish-and-pray business model.
I start thinking they’re somehow going to pull a 24-carrot gold rabbit out of a hat. Then I look at what they’ve done to the tour lately and think there’s nothing whatsoever in the hat except Dirk Ziff’s credit card.
What’s your take on the adorable Sophie Goldschmidt? Does it warm your heart to see a complete non-surfer as the face of surfing, rallying the crowd at Pipe, talking about Keramas while never actually having been there etc?
I met her for the first time last month, and she’s very bright, friendly, and professional. Whether she’s been to Bali or not doesn’t matter. The CT schedule matters. WSL’s ownership of Kelly’s pool matters. The audience matters. Or the perceived audience. The WSL isn’t playing to the existing fanbase, but to an imagined future fanbase. Which I don’t think exists, but there’s maybe a 10% chance I’m wrong. How to you let Pipe and Clouldbreak go, unless you’ve got an ace or two up your sleeve? Like, what are we NOT seeing here? Yeah, Sophie and the whole gang I met in Santa Monica last month struck me as being smart enough, and I’m for sure in secure enough, that I start thinking they’re somehow going to pull a 24-carrot gold rabbit out of a hat. Then I look at what they’ve done to the tour lately and think there’s nothing whatsoever in the hat except Dirk Ziff’s credit card.
Let’s imagine the rabbit in the WSL hat. Imagine. What could it be?
For me, the rabbit is a two-day event at roll-in First Reef Pipe for the title. For Sophie, it’s a prime-time medal round in a WSL-designed pool in Tokyo.
Do you think a world title, sans Pipe in a year featuring a pool would forever have an asterix next to it? Brodie Carr once told me he didn’t want to be known as the ASP CEO who lost Slater from the tour. Do you think Sophie would have similar concerns re: Pipe?
A world title without Pipe is a dinner gong for Red Bull to come in and save pro surfing from itself.
Could it be the other Australian fist on surfing’s neck? First take a Hawaiian outdoorsman’s activity and turn it into a professional sport. Now, wrench it from its birthplace and make it Australia-centered. WSL – where is your soul?
Imagine if the WSL catered to its current fans and not some imaginary fans
Yes! And had a patented backhand approach to Pipe titled, “Death grab into close out”. Quite amusing to watch the big primate eat shit instead of bananas 😜
Obviously not a Pipe Master. Maybe Bells was more their scene? I have a name but I’m going to save it until you drop the next clue 😜
hehehe
“Show me something more
Than the an honest girl turned thief or wore
Under African sun or Dublin rain
Necessities remain the same”
https://uploads.disquscdn.c…
That imagined future fan base strikes me as a problem in all this — both the wave pool talk and the pro circuit.
At the moment, there doesn’t seem to be any media strategy in place to make this happen. It’s like, oh hey, we have Facebook! But pretty much every brand on the planet has Facebook.
Surfing on the whole still feels very insular as an industry and pro sport. There’s nothing at all wrong with that, as long as the bro club can make enough money to keep the party going. If you need mainstream money, though, you’ll need to reach those people and convince them to open their wallets. Oh hey! Surfing! That’s cool. But that isn’t going to happen automatically. What’s the WSL doing to reach that future, mainstream audience they’re dreamin’ about?
The Olympics — where there are like a hundred other sports competing for attention — aren’t magically going to do the work of that.
Slater himself said (a couple years ago), “we don’t need the Olympics for surfing, we’ve already got our own thing”
What’s wrong with him? He has the prescience to say that, and now look here he/we’re at? Ughhhh!
Beyond a few stake-holders making some cash out of it, I doubt the Olympics will change much at all.
Yep, probably, but I hope it crashes and burns, they lose $, and never want to touch us again, because, really, we do have our own thing.
It the 80s, Duane Peters lamented about professional skateboarding, “they want it to be like football, and it’s not”
That’s what I’m talkin’ About!
Making it mainstream and to the Olympics. Whats the current state of affair WSL and pro surfing regarding sexual harassment? Shawn White is having a field day right now. Can only imagine the closet’s full of truth!
It’s okay Matt, I think you need to get into the water more, it’s not that big of a thing.
Been surfing since summer ’71… started in HB So Cal.
The surf mags, Surfer and Surfing, lost my support and subscription cash about 1983… way too many adds and commercial contest crap!
Have Satellite TV and only watch about 1 hour total per year of CBS Sports broadcasts of WSL contests!
Boring as hell watching two guys sitting for what seems like a hour per heat trying to catch a couple waves with the incessant boring trivial drivel spewed forth by the announcers and incessant replays of the few rides actually scored above a 7.0 trying desperately to otherwise fill dead-air/visual “nothingness” to keep an audience from switching channels! Found the only way I could watch a WSL broadcast was to record it then fast forward through 3 hours of the days broadcasted heats watching only about 20 minutes of actual surfing!
You can avoid the drivel, constant replays and ALL the commercials… entirely!
Not a great sales model as practiced currently by the WSL!
I would NEVERV pay to watch a live WSL broadcast!
You really think people who is in charge at WSL, investors, WSL heads, event organizers, sponsors… care a lot about Pipe now or in the future?
Dou you hear about F1 and the classic circuits (Zeltweg, Spa Francorchamps, Paul Ricard, Nuburgring, Kyalami…) vs Hermman Tilke circuits in asiatic countries?
Asks the pilots what they prefers… aks the cappos, investors, FIA and F1 heads, event organizers, sponsors, what they prefer? It’s money. New publics, new sponsors.
Do you really think it is about passion, pride and legacy, places?
It’s about MONEY.
Professional sports and their structures care ABOUT MONEY, care about personal stories of victorious “warriors” or defeated “warriors”, legends… Its not about places!
Maracanã and Wembley historical soccer arenas were demolished to dust, new and modern stadiuns built.
It’s about MONEY. And, about what can generate more… MONEY!
F1 is a great comparison, the alters of speed were sacrificed for safety! WSL is losing the fearsome waves off their calendar (whither they want to or not), and they expect the show to remain as compelling! Modern F1 isn’t a patch on what it was with those old tracks, the gladiator spirit of it is mostly gone, same as with the new tour!
Bullseye Jimmy! Exactly!
About the F1 take an onboard lap at Spa… full speed… and take one at an asiatic circuit… It’s about people around
Tha concept of arenas, public near the pilots and cars…
Most of the legendary circuits run into forests and lakes, too difficult for peoples aproach…difficult places to set up bleachers.
They kill speed for more concentrated arenas, and added to this new countries, and people, without any knowledge of the sport.
They don’t care about people’s knowledge for surf.
That’s why pool events it’s so attractive to WSL… to attract any people in any country, fisically and in opinions… it doesn’t matter to them whether people’s opinions are absurd and without knowledge, or accurate because are surfers or surf lovers.
For them, fuck the places, do you really think Sophie, deeper inside, care about Pipe?
They care about new souls on demand….
If the new circuit bring to them, millions of money and tons of viewers… fuck Pipe, Hawaii, Trestles, Tchopo, and you know why?
THEY HAVE POOL Technology!
They have now, arenas to go to any other country in the world.
The problem is the alienating of the core viewers and the cost of building pools and resorts at $100m a pop….unless of course they can duplicate Pipe and Chopes in a pool?
Brutus the costs of Olympics in “raising” countries is totally covered by local politicals, investors, banking and great companies… all corrupts!
That’a the move made by FIA / F1, FIFA, and Olympics look at the list of host countries (minus Japan now, but they have money)
Amazing when you think that the Surf Industry keeps getting smaller so a lot less $ for marketing , Governments have to now chip in to keep the events , Australia got a $6m grant from the Govt, for their 2 Olympic athletes…..fuck if we have a recession in the next few years there will NO sponsors at all left for surfing!
one can only hope. time to get back to mowing foam and gluing up rubber already. the only surf clothing should be t-shirts and hats from shapers and wetsuit companies, maybe foam, fins and Hexcel too.
Interesting analogy with F1, but after Senna’s death , it was realized that the cars were so fast that , there was no way to survive high speed crashes , so better safety regulations were brought in , but the cars kept getting faster every year , so regulations were brought in every year to curb the speed , and by the end of the year they were breaking records ……
I think F1 is really exciting right now with the Hybrid engines , and they have broken every old V8 records …..
The WSL is just trying to work out how to make $’s and does not look good right now …the question should be , “Whats the new tour going to look like?”
Okay, I don’t want to get into the safety argument, there are two sides ever since Jackie Stewart took up the fight in the 70s, but let’s discuss the analogy of F1 leaving its core audience behind to look for new audiences in the USA and Asia!
F1 has moved from historic tracks largely in Europe with a core fan base to countries who are seen as new opening markets. This year there will be no German GP, but there will be a few in east Asia with empty stands! After much fanfare a lot of the new tracks are being binned, no more Turkey, no more Malaysia, the list goes on! So F1 is left having fucked up royaly, alienating the core, and failing to attract the new markets, just like the WSL might! Austin has been a major success though!
ha and what does WSL have in common with F1…both owned by USA corporations !
Europe has always been the core of F1 , the German GP will be back next year , internal politics this year no go!
Malaysia is one of the best tracks for the drivers , but $’s for continuing were not forthcoming think WSL/Fiji..
The change fro V8’s to V6 Hybrids relly hurt the sport , but coming back big time now as it’s getting really competive and very fast!
Well traditional sources of revenue – cigarette sponsorship/ surfwear sponsorship – are fading, also Hawaii will be back in 2020!
That move is made not only by speed
Speed is one of the sides… the public in Europe, the core for F1, constantly diminished, and so the tv audience (apart Italy on both cases), and the high price of maintenance of the circuits… all this counts in the heads of the chairmans of FIA and F1.
Even the proximity of European countries to lower travel values, prevented the movement in search of new places and partners.
The money generated in these new countries is much higher.
And now the combustion engines are being banned until 2030 in almost every major European city center, all car makers, are gradually abandoning the major categories to focus on … FE (Eletric Formula) which is all mounted on street circuits in major cities around the world.
The biggest category and competition of cars with hybrid engines, the real laboratory of the future automobile was being Le Mans with Audi, Porsche and Toyota, Peugeot (which has already abandoned some time) … and DTM with Mercedes, Audi, BMW…
Audi and Porsche have abandoned Le Mans already in 2018 …
Mercedes, Audi and BMW abandoned DTM last year.
Do you know where they are? All together with other great brands in FE !!!
The true future of the auto industry.
Surf slowly and gradual are taking a path like this.
I agree that Formula E is the future , but the whining of the motors does not appeal to the Rev heads , as was found in F1 when they had quiet engines first year and had to go back to the drawing board to create more of a muscle engine sound…to entertain the masses!
Plus F1 is owned by the merrycans , so they are looking for growth in Asia/USA to make $’s
the problem with WSL mentality, and everything money-driven is the constant striving for growth. very often that need for growth will result in attempts to change those things that are viewed as limitations to that necessary growth. the wavepool is a perfect example of this. i’d argue the vast majority of surfers don’t want to see the playing field “evened” this way, it eliminates one of the essential skills of wave/ocean reading necessary to be a true badass but the Ziff crew is all over it because they know it can be brought to you Friday night at 9:00pm and the advertisers know its going to run and how many eyeballs they can count on, which is the real driver in all of this.
Agree.
On any Sunday.
They dream big of wave pool stadiums and franchises in different cities with wealthy owners sponsoring surfers to represent their pool.
Each pool just a little different than the other.
NFL, NBA, IPL, Nascar.
They want all the fanfare that surfers dont want.
i like to think surfing has too much history (baggage/integrity) to be exploited in the manner that Rollerblading and Freestyle Moto guys have been but we’re certainly broke and unskilled enough to accept whatever arrangement is presented and agents are just trying to make their 10% or 15% of the energy drink money.
Soooooo, IYO the industry has been healthy thus far?
Man… you guys don’t realize the next step it is Olympics Games ans similars? It is take surf to a sport like the mainstream sports?
It is too difficult see this? It’s so clear!
What you taked about OK Corrall Ranch… ops! sorry! KS Wave Ranch it is a glimpse of what is to come.
And lots of money, lots of money (but not like the mainstream sports…) to investors, WSL, event organizers… and even… midias!
Sports fighting to put theirs agendas in the Olympics.
Jiu Jitsu are hunger, absurdely hunger, to put his agenda in Olympics.
Even with MMA around…
If you guys have not noticed, surf is taking a turn in front of everyone. Like industrial revolution, digital revolution …
Surf is entering another era.
Whether it’s good or bad, let each one choose your side and have your say.
It’s irreversible.
This got no relation with Pipe, Trestles, hawaiin pride and legacy, skills, style, flesh and bones!
MONEY!
This is about MONEY!
Show me the MONEY!
https://www.youtube.com/wat…
Well, I reckon the olympics only work because they are on once every 4/2 years and we all get to sit around pretend we are all experts* on incest dancing without having to have a lot of people knowledgable about it telling us we are wrong. Having a surf connest every other month is too often for Joe Public to get involved in the distinctions between each event. Arguably, Portugal was heavier than Pipe this year, but I think more would be interested in Pipe than Ports.
My non-surfing neighbour thinks Waimea is the most iconic wave in surfing. She wouldn’t have a clue about anything else that happens, but that’s the first image of surfing that comes to her mind when asked of surfing.
Incidentally, I’m closer to getting the actual scores right in incest dancing than I am with any wave scores selected by the wsl expert judges. Maybe the judging system needs work?
I don’t like that direction surf turns…
I’m love competitive surf, heats, and the great legends I’m growing cheering and following since 70’s decade…
But this new path, it’s so clear!
The public target it’s no more we, all surf lovers… These people now on charge careless about us.
They want new flesh, new people, surfers or not. They don’t care more about specialized guys or girls, surfers, even in comment sections.
They care about numbers: people and money.
Most guys and girls wearing surfwear today are non surfers.
I have a shit ton of money,,,,that sport looks fun,,,,I think I will buy this sport…surfing is cool!! Lets make it cooler!!! Wait…what!!!!! There are rules here?? What do you mean, I own the sport???,,,This isnt cool, im taking my sport and going somewhere else. NO MORE SPORT FOR YOU!!!
Unless you beg me,
Sincerely, The new owners of Surfing.
you can own a contest. you can not own surfing.
Tell that to Kelly Slater (and friends).
no, pro surfing has nothing to do with my surf experience. it does not matter if kelly slater and pro surfing did not exist. I still will surf. i didn’t start surfing because of them. it had no relation to them actually.
How many fins are on your surfboards?
3 mediums, on my 10’2 pintail. allows for an angled take off and easier to steer. but the tail comes free at the take off when the wave jacks too fast.
One on the 8’6 Brewer.
One on my log.
2 on the fish
Simon Anderson Reno Abellira Mark Richards, even if pro surfing doesn’t influence us on a personal level, it does on a performance level #surflikeroy
https://youtu.be/gEg5SdJunn4
Work Union!
Reference: Nathan Tinkler buying Newcastle Knights, Newcastle Jets and Horse Racing.
Everyone blinded by the Emperor’s money and grand plans and look how it all ended up.
The cat eventually gets tired of the string and finds a new toy.
Thats what keeps the WSL up at night.
I still don’t get it. The whole thing is still ultimately a marketing excercise. A glorified advert for whatever brands sign up for it.
That gloss coat of consumerist dreck alone puts (in my eyes) the whole kit and kaboodle in very shady territory for my interest.
Yeah it shows some good surfing in various bits round the world, but the soul of it is dripping filth.
Just the fact that now Pipe is off the schedule means there has to be asterisks after the name of whoever wins this coming year and in years to come, if the playing field is not theoretically equal or better. (Better than Pipe?)
I propose a core tour shorn of any visible marketing, save small end-credit rolls of the sponsors. The best waves, the best surfers, no real circus and no fucking-up permits. No chance in hell, but you gotta dream.
Dripping filth! Fuck yes, there is no soul left.
asterisks unless its JJF
yes, professional sports is essentially a marketing exercise and the “league” is the set of administrators that take some fee/benefit for middle-manning the transfer of money from the brands to the athletes/performers. in general, the athletes get what they deserve from these administrators when they can’t see the big picture.
2019 WSL Lessons Learned Meeting Agenda:
– Set calendar reminder for permit due dates
– Discuss who will be pivot man in next circle jerk
– Form circle
I also opine that a circle jerk could resolve the Pipe issue. Somebody call Kirk Caldwell urgently and organise the circle. Sophie is not invited.
You can look at this two ways. The current WSL hierarchy have gleaming, fresh eyes, unencumbered by tradition and the old boys club mentality. Or they are completely fucking out of their depth and drink driving the WSL bus over the cliff. Either way, pro surfing is in for some monumental change. Whether surfers like it or not.
While watching the Olympics right now I’m having a hard time seeing the appeal of watching a full contest in a pool for regular people. Most of the appeal in these events is the danger involved and the possibility someone is gonna eat shit bombing down the hill leaving their skis behind and flying into the crowd like a Kim Jong un practice missle. Even brother/sister ice incest dancing has more consequence than surfing a chest high wave pool.
“Incest dancing” fucking genius there regularguy
Does the scoring for slopestyle and the pipe not make you wonder why surfing can’t get it right?
Yes
That’s the problem with having a script.
I’m sure they will get it right once everything becomes a routine. It might be one of the least impressive routines the olympics has to offer. Top turns and crouching in a tube doesn’t really stand up to guys chucking huge airs in slope style or super pipe or the hyper athletic shit people do in figure skating.
a fake tube that a locomotive made, you can script this.
Spin to win. Hold your grabs. Don’t worry about style and make sure your interviews come across as scripted. Here’s a trophy.
Pipe goes from dream to pipe dream.
A Shakespearean Tragedy.
Nicely done
as the WSL becomes a major world punter , and Ziffy continues to dream of making his millions back ,lets have a look at the WSL dream and money spent and a way forward .
So far a guesstimation of whats been spent and being spent ….
CT/WSL ……..$150m
2018/19……….$50
poolemoore….$30m
pool Japan……$30m
pool Florida…..$43m
So there’s an investment about $300 m +……or at this stage a huge punt to try and make back the money spent and build a business model where eventually there should be a royalty scheme of the pools and/or PPV for the WSL.
How’s it going so far…..” oh if there’s no surf in Japan during the Olympics , maybe the IOC might use our pool.” …..$30m punt what odds for using a pool in Japan , I reckon 100/1….
WSL has alienated the core viewers by trying develop a product for the masses , and now the interest levels are waning lets do a new tour , no Pipeline , but a pool event is going to revolutionize the way we see surfing NOT!
A $300m+ gamble and the WSL is in shambles …..how the hell is Ziffy even going to recoup his investment let alone make money?
Woke Warshaw