"He oozed closer and jerked his hips!"
I enjoy, very much, any conversation with Australian surfboard shaper and architect of floating reefs, environmental friendly shark nets and yet-to-be-built-best-wavepool-ever, Greg Webber.
Greg, who is fifty-nine, and with a mouth sticky with cocktails, made concaves his own personal fiefdom, beginning in the late eighties. Thirty-five years on, his designs are adored by Kelly Slater.
He is the inventor of a yet-to-be-made wavepool so good that he insists it will make the little blue veins in your neck bulge like delicate pencil marks.
His shark nets promise a bloodless solution to Great Whites hitting surfers.
In private, Webber will offer a complex case for single-sex hierarchies in society and will posit that we spend too long on love, lovers past and present, as well as sexual jealousy.
But, not today.
Society isn’t ready for his revolutionary thoughts, he says.
In this podcast, Charlie and I listen politely and then clap like children after Greg’s opening gambit of sex games with a crotch-grabbing midget on the Indonesian island of Sumbawa.
A compelling reason to travel.
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Chas Smith has a very gay voice
Fascinating interview.
Can’t help but acknowledge his energy and enthusiasm.
But what’s at the other end of the spectrum to “cautious enthusiasm”? Outright delusional self belief???
Wouldn’t call him that but jesus christ he’s almost got a bit of a Jesus complex going on doesn’t he???
We’ll see.
Question I would have liked to hear him asked for each of his inventions would be “what are the negatives?”. Got a feeling he might have answered “none”, which would really worry me
I’ve designed some really stupid things but only realised after allowing the first phases to go on and on as though it was a great idea. And yes it was tiring for me to listen to too, but it’ll be interesting to see what happens and what doesn’t.
I think my perceptions are a reflection of my science background: I like cautious optimism with a recognition (usually volunteered) of the limitations and flaws.
Frankly Greg, across numerous websites and many interviews I have never really heard (or read) you describing potential problems with any of your concepts.
If so, it is rapidly glossed over and quickly moves on to how awesome they are.
I do genuinely admire your passion, vision and enthusiasm. I think you are a unique and talented individual.
However, everything in the world has pro’s and cons. For example, what’s the downside to 50 pools in India? And 100’s more around the world?
Can you guarantee the surfer to wave ratio out in the ocean will be improved, or can you acknowledge that it will potentially be massively worsened?
Even with all those artificial reefs I can only see the surfer to wave ratio being worsened by mass proliferation of your pools
Ok but didn’t you hear me say that my overall objective with wave making, whether it is in a Wavepool on land Or an artificial reef in the ocean or A wave reflecting device is that we oversupply waves? That is wholy and completely and utterly different to anyone else in the business world where the priority, in order to stabilise projections based on shorter Term data is to have occupancy or use at the highest level. Also even though I blurted out many thousands of words in an hour and a half how on earth can I extend on each individual concept or idea to the degree that anyone like you would fully comprehend or understand it?
Ok, let me restate it another way.
Firstly, what are you trying to achieve? What is the most likely outcome, the best case scenario, the worst case scenario and the likelihood of each?
How bad is the worst case scenario and what is the likelihood of it occurring? That is simple risk management 101 in a nutshell.
It’s the way scientists, policy makers, the aviation industry and just about everyone else operates.
On the one hand you are talking pretty big about not only your wavepool being the best but also about syndicating/franchising them throughout inland and non-traditional surf areas like India etc such that people with no access to a surfable coastline can become competent surfers. On the other you’re talking about artificial reefs adding surfable peaks to otherwise largely unsurfable coastlines.
What if you get the balance wrong or lose control of the balance? Net result may be many, many competent surfers being produced yet not that many extra ocean waves being added. And where are all those many newly competent inland surfers going to be headed eventually…the ocean of course!
What if literally thousands of your pools are built? Is that your best case scenario? Are you planning on limiting the number of pools built even if there is huge demand, in the name of keeping ocean breaks uncrowded?
It doesn’t sound like you are.
Can you acknowledge this is a potential outcome? If so why even go down the artificial wave pool pathway?
As per my intro, if the worst case scenario is horrific (even though it’s highly unlikely) then why even take the risk? It is probably not your or my surfing experience that will be ruined in 20 years time but may be our kids, so why even take the risk?
It would seem in this instance that the worst case scenario becomes more likely with every new pool built. Is that what you really want?? Once you start how on earth can you stop it, especially given how awesome your pools are purported to be?
In the 70’s I skated in the pymble pool since there was not one skate park in all of Australia and none in the States either. Now there are just over 4800 world wide. Are the streets infested with skaters? The streets are the parallel to the beaches and the skate park the parallel to the wave pool. As I said as more surfers are created more reefs or man made surf spots will be created and the supply will be more than the demand since things like the Vwall I’ve designed has three other purposes beyond surfing. 1. Two perfect wedge waves either side. This bumps up land values where otherwise there’d be close outs.
2. Safe swimming zones in the lee where wave size is reduced. Clubbies will place their flags there and there will far fewer drownings.
3. Erosion protection via sand buildup in the lee.
4. Habitat creation.
So yeah I don’t think the key breaks will get over crowded. With only 5 of these things north of Kirra the crowd at snapper will drop. 10 wedges with 20 surfers each side equals 200 surfers not at Snapper.
Again depends on whether you can control the number of your pools built and hence the number of new surfers produced.
If the pools are as good as you say they are then they should proliferate very rapidly. Are you sure you can control the number built given they’re likely to be so awesome? If so how?
Or do you want as many built as possible??
As you said, you don’t think the key breaks will get over crowded as a result of your pools, in other words you consider this outcome unlikely.
But if it does eventuate then the consequences are awful.
Every new pool brings this worst case scenario closer to reality.
You still want to take this risk?
Okay I’ll admit to being slightly frustrated with not so much the scientific method but the defensiveness and cautious optimism which you mentioned. I’ll give you a prime example: hang on it’s actually in the podcast which kind of shows that you didn’t probably listen to the whole thing which I can’t blame you for. When I mentioned an engineer who started our meeting by letting me know about some data that he have just received in relation to some wave forces on a physical structure in the ocean. And of course those forces were massive. But I have had a feeling which is not very scientific, which goes without saying because feelings in essence Are not very scientific, but guess what? if the mind type is grounded in The scientific method as nine is, and on top of that the same brain has seen how deviating from that scientific method can create significant breakthroughs, then ‘Feeling’ oddly enough which is just a sensation within this phenomenal computer which is the human brain, can actually be The best guide. Two great examples are when a Polish scientist put forward the theory that gammaray burst are just as likely to have come from cosmological distances as they are to have come from within our galaxy. Obviously based on the random pattern of the gammaray burst when they finally worked out how to send them. If those bursts were within Our galaxy then they would have a planar distribution. He was ridiculed and it took 20 years for data to come in and support his theory. At which point stunningly 50% of the scientist still chose to reject his theory for fuck sake! That shattered the guy unequivocal data was presented to all scientists in that field and still some fuck wits with their own ego problems decided to hold off on acknowledging the fact that he was right all along. The second one was during the race to get to the moon and how the Russians chose totally wild approach to rerouting the exhaust gases from the combustion in the main chamber back into the prechamber which created temperatures that were beyond what the Americans thought were handleable. Over 20 years later NASA ended up buying 20 or 30 of these phenomenal rocket engines, Which created more than 25% additional thrust than any of the rocket engines that America had created in the following 20+ years. So yes I love the scientific method as a base but I am fastly more inspired by radical experimentation where as per the Russians you just test it, And if it blows up you take readings from pre-launch to disaster and work out what the hell went wrong. That’s why I do ridiculous experiments that are in no way designed to make a functional end product but to learn by making something that no one would bother to make otherwise
Great to hear Greg speak… Part 2 -3 -4… Please!
As proof of his new groundbreaking, unifying theory on gender, Weber cites “Five highly intelligent females in their 40’s and 50’s” and an “uncle, some aunties and his mother.” (a truly massive and varied sample size). And right after that profound statement of ethos, Chas says, “How in the world did you come to surf.” – in his best fan boy voice!
Come on Charlie. Brings back memories of the interview with ELO.
Critics are not proof. They just indicate as to whether you’re on the mark or not. And the input from family is totally valid since their lives span several of the most critical decades for change and they are all highly talented and groundbreaking as individuals. I could have added the 20,000 Conversations I’ve had with women or the depth to which I’ve related to the women I’ve had relationships with, but mate I fitted in as much as I could for the time I had.
Fair enough, Greg.
A couple of thoughts:
1. To some extent, I would say bad on me for forgetting that Dirty Water or Beach Grit is any place other than for fodder. Yet, Chas, and to a far lesser extent, Derek, do not hesitate to criticize – and not always in a tongue-in-cheek manner. So in this case, I would say my comments were in large measure directed at Chas for being the sychophant he claims to to abhor.
2. I get that anecdotal information is useful – but it goes without saying it has severe limitations. When you made some pretty sweeping allusions and then backed it up with the scant support – it was hard to listen to without some extended elaboration and more scientific support. Perhaps you could have chosen your words more carefully by qualification; and some acknowledgement that this was not necessarily to the place to take a deep dive. We are certainly living in a time when the rigors of science should be the norm. As you may know, in the US we are stuck with president whose greatest hits in the Covid crisis include drinking disinfectant, sending light through the body, taking hydroxchloroquine; and now oleandrin.
I am reminded of the fact, again, that this podcast has never claimed to be anything but sophomoric banter. And I should not expect anything else. The fact that this came up right after a story about voyeurism regarding a pygmie and a thatched hut, should have been my clue to let it go. Yet, in the end, this is the only time I have ever replied back on a message board – so to some end – it served a purpose.
Best Regards,
Walter
Yes Walter it’s just a thread on a surfing site and I’m just introducing the fact that I’ve got some theories on gender and of course my entire theory would need not only a few hundred pages to outline but would also want some data. And that data source I’m designing since it’s difficult to get anyone to admit to their insecurities whether male or female and so how you ask the questions in your study is critical. Eg when a study a week ago asked a high socioeconomic range of Americans If they’d vote for Trump they got a certain percentage. Then after another 20 or so questions they asked if they felt totally comfortable to mention to friends who they were voting for and the figure of those saying that they were not comfortable was higher than the first figure. So exploiting data is a game play on both sides. It’s natural to put a slant on a study if you’re not totally objective, and most studies have a direction/agenda to start off with. I’m being objective because I adore the time when surfing was totally uncommercialised. And if wave pools and artificial reefs make it more so then I’m definitely disappointed to a degree but we have a choice. More people on earth experiencing the phenomenal feelings associated with the act of surfing itself on a daily level, or less.
Greg talks too much.
True. Not in the morning though. 2 to 3 hours of not saying a word. Usually on rock platforms where you’ll only see one fisherman at best and they don’t want to talk either.
Edit, edit, edit. One hour 32 should be 45 minutes. Fell asleep (I am old and surfed all morning) so perhaps I am incorrect but I fear not.
I was thinking 20 minutes is a good limit. Much over that and it requires too much commitment from your audience and a suggestion to the boys, make sure you cover the impactful topics first cause no one is listening to minute 84.
I would think the podcast tool has a metric that allows the root user to see the engagement time. But yes, 20-40 minutes or so I would think optimum.
I know nothing about poddies, just instinct in an age of short attention spans.
With people not commuting in horrific traffic, who has the time?
@The Bitchy Crab (Disqus):disqus Seriously, how much are Manscape paying you to push the product, or is it part of using Itunes etc as a platform?
Peanuts. But a dirham here, a dirham there, keeps the everything-free dream alive.
Keep up the good work, It’s like Larry David himself wrote them.
I met Larry and Jerry once at Castlerock Entertainment.
Did not go well.
You didn’t bring a marble rye?
I didn’t know who the old guy was…. just recognized Jerry. It went from awkward to worse as the elevator doors opened and we all went to the same executive office where we were casually introduced.
You farted in the elevator, didn’t you?
pitched an idea for an episode….
Which was?
filmed and aired 3 years later….
Super Market line to pay and a woman at the front of the line is gossiping with the check out stand employee oblivious that the line is stalled. After the two women are made aware of the delay, the shopper searches through an enormous purse trying to locate her check book as contents spill and spill out on to the conveyor belt and she begins to write her check.
Larry droned on and on about being a professional writer and how sick he is of rank amateurs telling him how to write the show and everywhere he goes dick heads interrupt his thought process with shitty ideas. It wasn’t an easy elevator ride.
Jerry folded his arms and bit his tongue, equally unhappy with Larry taking credit for the greatest TV show in history, how dare some Hippy invade his personal space right before the “big meeting” and then we walk straight into Hank’s office.
“Hey Hippy, can you expedite the installation, our guests called and are arriving early”
“Yes sir, Mr Mc Cann….”
Oh. A silent but deadly fart eh?
its getting pushed across a few podcasts I listen to. I can say with certainty that Derek and chas are coming up very short in their efforts to sell them. the boys at hello sport are really having some fun with it.
People who believe they have all the answers seldom have any answers.
I imagine that in person he’d be exhausting to engage with.
Very interested in midget sex games. Will listen, but will obviously be bored until midget sex games.
Comes in very quick.
Excuse the pun!
WPPS…
(what Party Pete said)
I’ll listen to it later.
Paddled out to an empty peak or three today. Oil mirror, no trace of wind, still as.
Contestable 3’… maybe the odd shoulder high. Better ones were too A framey as your second hit would be at half the size of your take off. More the point, those waves wouldn’t collide with the lefts bearing down on the southerly sets. Still fun and warm as fuck.
Enjoying the Hippy quiet. A man, a bunch of mangled dolphins and the odd seal.
No wind. Did I mention that? Zero.
Down the berm, one by two, they arrived. Escapee’s from inhuman heat inland. What were they carrying? Soft boards.
Thankfully, none of them made it beyond the middle shallow section.
But they were so loud. Only a dozen or so and yet it sounded like a playground.
Even the pelican looked annoyed. Seagull had split a while before.
Tide pushed too far over the trench and a change of venue was my choice.
Arrived at prime time high tide sand bank… in fact, the low 4 tide gets better as it fills in, but it won’t today. Even so, more windless perfect little wedges on offer and still hot as fuck. Lonely little tastes of heaven twist and wind, unmolested.
Only problem was, I couldn’t find parking. Same beach that was virtually empty pre Covid. Now, everyday is fourth of July or Labor day.
I know I should not have, but I did.
Pushed the cones protecting an RV’s “field Kitchen tent” away and parked perpedicular to the sea wall (legal).
I knew he would confront. Barely 10 in the morning and already several Coors lights in, he had to pull his shorts up because the elastic had relented.
Now most of these parking interlopers don’t touch the sand. No. They Tailgate on the dirty parking lot. The beach is empty ish.
Decided to fuck with my new friend. The beads of sweat below his nose rose visibly as he explained his right as an American to the parking space I had just absconded.
A negotiation of sorts incurred, though one must mention that his mind was made up…. the cones enforced his possession and I crossed the line in his sand.
Seagull landed nearby and stole a corn chip or two from the end table he had set up near his recliner chair propped underneath the main tent. Main as in an extension of the massive RV.
As angry as he was with me, he was more pissed at the seagull. I had only stolen his field kitchen’s designated area for my parking. The seagull had stolen the reason he had to live the next 10 minutes as I slid out during the brief distraction.
Of course, I hid my key nowhere near my car and because they did not touch the sand, my key was hiding in their plain sight.
Returned to my car and a half dozen “Don’t tread on Me’s” staring me down. So many cops now in the area, I took comfort in their proximity that never was before. Everything, you see, is ramped up beyond imagination.
“Hey fuck you get that piece of shit out of here”… the rude man said to my sensible Camry.
“Too bad you guys can’t park here overnight and you have to go back to that shit hole you live in”
“Fuck you asshole”
They got their field kitchen back and I drove home. We both got what we wanted. You see how cooperation works my friends?
Comprehensive.
was the word count above what Disqus allows?
it’s been a day of confrontation, maybe it’s the temperature?
Summer is too long before it began. You’re stuck in winter and pumping surf Drek? FUCK YOU.
Not a single bead of sweat on my upper lip, it’s all just due point from the Miller lite’s sweating cans.
I think one more paragraph and the Disqus bots would have put you into the spam box.
Why? Kurtfanningwhatever drones on and on and on and on and on and on and on
Just spoke to Charlie on a FT call. He was sweaty.
Pretty good little read, but not one reference to a shark. Charlie, you taking notes here?
I am guessing the “escapees” were from the 909 or other similar bastions of health and beauty.
The 909 were the plague in my Newps days, but no, these are Santa Claritans and Bako’s… have no idea what their area codes are.
The Hippy abides
Love it Hippy. You should have really pissed em off and screamed out Biden/Harris 2020 as the sensible Camry pulled away triumphant!
This is perfection, “…he had to pull his shorts up because the elastic had relented.”
Architect maybe, but has he found a builder?
Oh you must listen. Orlando etc.
My review is there – trinkets???
Coming to beautiful Belmont North.